Edward Fitzgerald and Margaret Talbot

Hi Rita.

They probably went to Canada with The Talbot settlers from north Tipperary in 1818.

A lot of research has been done on this group if you Google it.

I will  search for relatives of theirs who may have stayed in Tipperary on the Tithes and Griffiths, if you would like me to.

Christina.

I have referred to the materials, F.T. Rossers book, Pioneers of London Township",  Bruce Elliotts book, "Irish Migrants in the Canadas," and have found much.  I have not found verifiable information for Edward Fitzgerald and Margaret Talbot Fitzgerald.  I have found some information about his military service as a British officer in Canada from muster lists.  One of the books I was reading stated Margaret was of "English" royalty.  However I have not verified it with Parish records.  Any assistance would be most helpful!  Thank you.

Hi Rita.

There is a biography for Richard Talbot on line 1851 to 1860.

I found them on the Tithes 1825 Landlords.

Will try and find where you can Baptism records.

Christina.

I saw in a book, where Margaret is actually Richard Talbot's twin sister!  She did come with him apparently.  However, I believe Edward was already in Canada.  Anyway--I am going to Ireland and London in August...to search-- I am hopeful I can naroow ancestors to their parishes or nearby ...just for time savings! 

any ideas would be appreciated!

Rita

Rita,

I saw your post and wanted to reach out.  My Fitzgerald ancestors are from the same area as yours and my geneologists appears to list your Edward with a wife named Margaret and a child named Frederick Fitzgerald, - born 1803 in the same parish.  I thought my 4 x Great Grandfather, Michael Fitzgerald (married in 1805), may be a brother or cousin/relative of your Edward.  Through DNA testing my Fitzgerald males connect with other families with roots in Tipperary, Kilkenney, and Laois.  By chnace have any of the male line descedants of your Edward Fitzgerald conducted any yDNA testing?  My Fitzgeralds are haplogroup "R" and wondered if yours might be as well.

I know almost everything about my Michael Fitzgerald except definatively who his siblings and parents were.  I think he may have had a brother named Patrick and a sister named Bridget.  He named his First son James, so that may have been his father's name.  This James (from whom I descend) named a son Edward and therefore I thought, maybe your Edward - might be an uncle.

Any response is truly apprecaited,

Maurice FitzGerald

Maurice,

I recently did a DNA test and have joined Ancestry.Ca. I have found this history very interesting and based on a lot of other records traced the tree back to the 1700's. 

I am also looking to find more about the Talbots and Fitzgerald clans.

My DNA results show more than 1000 distant relatives.

Pat

That would be great if you could assist!

The history that I need is before 1790s.  It hs been documented the Howard's and Fitzgerald's arrived most likely in 1819, right after Talbots group.  Our Margaret Talbot (Married.Edward Fitzgerald) most likely is related to Richard Talbot, he also has daughter named Margaret (not ours). Bruce Elliott puts the Fitzgeralds and Howards possibly on the Camperdown ship sailing from Limerick June 25, 1819 and arriving Quebec Sept. 7, 1819.(p.86 & 92, Irish Migrants in the Canadas, 1988.)

I investigated the connection of Col. Thomas Talbot of Malahide Castle, and these Talbots--I found nothing conclusive, however there is some evidence. (I think Margaret could have been daughter of Baronness Margaret and Lord Richard, however--I cannot find the record of this named daughter.  This would have made her Col. Thomas Talbot's sister. (Thomas was founder of London, Ontario, given much land by the crown through his friend Lord Wellesslly, Gov. of Ireland at this time. (Richard could have even been a brother, but I dont know).

There are written stories of Margaret Talbot Fitzgerald being of English royalty (from Canada Uprising of 1837), being from Clonen Castle daughter of "Thomas Talbot" (p.67., London Township Pioneers); there is also family lore of her being related to Catherine Howard, wife of Henry the VIII--through her uncle who battled with Lord Worselly. There are also claims of relation to the Earl of Shrewsbury, I have pinned down some possiblities of these latter generation, but nothing concrete.  It is claimed Thomas Talbot was one of the Earls of Shrewsbury.

Other relatives named are Thomas T. Howard of Moneygall who was Samuel Howard's brother and a Brunswick passenger.  Samuel's brother in law, George T. Fitgerald (This would have been wife Ann Fitzgerald's brother) also wrote Lord Bathurst asking for passage right after the Talbot immigration. Also stated here was all imigrated along with brothers and sisters in 1819,(p.86, Elliott).

I retrieved a baptism record Margaret Howard, (Samuel and Ann Howards oldest daughter Margaret Howard (my gr.gr.gr.grandmother) Baptism date March 10,1811, place was Templemore and Killea and Killovinoge and Templeret, Tipperary, Ireland. FHL Film #990092. 

I would like to verify Ann's parents residence --(Edward Fitzgerald and Margaret Talbot Fitzgerald). As well as Samuel Howard's family residence.  I believe the elder Edward Fitzgerald and Samuel Howard, his son-in-law were in the military.  In the book"London Township Pioneers", (Rosser, 1975), It is stated Samuel is Thomas Howard's son, Thomas Howard was a Talbot settler.  It also states the elder Fitzgerald was in manufacturing--I still believe he had some military experience--as he led a quiet militia and voted "no" to rebel in the Canada rebellion of 1837.

Additional information puts Thomas T. Howard, Samuels brother as a resident of Cloghjordan, Modreeny parish County Tipperary in 1818 (he was a Brunswick passenger).

other information puts a Talbot settler, Thomas Talbot of Clonmel, County Tipperary, son of William and Mary (Carr) Talbot. (I believe this to be a Richard Talbot relative & possibly Margaret Talbots relative).

I think most of these families are related, I havent been able to verify much beyond a few baptisms, and nothing concrete before Edward and Margret (Talbot) Fitzgerald .....

Any assistance would be very helpful!

Rita McLaughlin

Rita - I am somewhat confident that my FitzGeralds are related to yours and I found a birth record for Edward and Margaret's daughter in the the parish near Templetouhy.  

Pat - thank you for your reply.  I would like to encourage you to test with FTDNA as they have 288 males signed up for the Fitzgerald Surname Study.  Your yDNA will show you to which group you may connect.  My group has a few unique markers which will stick out and make it easy for us to determine if we share a common ancestor.  My FitzGeralds are from Templetouhy, Tipperary and the surrounding areas.  My FitzGeralds have a connection through yDNA with a Kilkenny branch as well.  By chance do you know if your ancestors are connected with these Templetuohy FitzGeralds of whom Rita is posting?

Thanks 

Maurice,

I have ordered a DNA kit from FTDNA as per your suggestion.

In a family book put together in 2003 it says the Edward Fitzgerald first arrived in America from Ireland where he purchased a tract of land in what is now New York City but with the break out of the war  of 1812 it was confiscated. With the Fitzgerald temper he returned to Ireland vowing never to return. However, he was convinced by Thomas Talbot to return to Canada with a brother Frederick. They settled the London Ontario area.  From there they started to spread out in both Canada and the US. I am looking forward to get results from the new test as Ancestry DNA shows very little in Ireland or Europe.

Pat

Pat,

Thank you for the response.  I look forward to hearing about your results.  Once you test with FTDNA, they will match you with numerous people with whom you share close yDNA ancestry (be prepared for multiple surnames), and you can joing various projects.  Even if we are not a close match,  the Fitzgerald project will show if there is a possible distant common ancestor.  As to be expected, note all Fitzgerald males are even remotely related.  However, as your family hales from the exact same parish as mine, I am very hopefull that there will be a connection within the last 300 years.  My paper trail ends around 1780, but yDNA has helped to expand other more distant Fitzgerald connections.  Thank you for testing with FTDNA and lets hope it is fruitful.

Maurice

Maurice

I have received the results of my Ydna (kit MI 45982) Shows haplogroup R like yours. I’m still attemping to navigate through all the number. Looking forward to learning more.

Pat

I am still verifying members of the families from Roscrea, Ireland area, the Edward Fitzgerald family and Margaret Talbot Fitzgerald. My fathers DNA is on 23nme, William McLaughlin.  My test is with Ancestry.com, my tree is Haney-McLaughlin.  Books show of Margaret as the daughter of Thomas Talbot of Clonen castle, but I find no other information.

I have recently found in "London Township Families, Past and Present", Vol. II where Margaret is either the sister or first cousin of Richard Steel Talbot. He would be possibly related to the RIchaard Talbot who brought migrates over in 1818. My family migrated in 1819.

Their daughter, Ann married Samuel Howard. It is though Thomas, a settler of the Talbot trip in 1818 is a brother to Samuel.

I do also susbscribe to Ancestry UK., the tree is Howard/Talbot/Fitzgerald--I hope to combine all of the information to one site or the other soon!

I recently have found a DNA match of a Howard in England, I have leaned into the England reesearch, due to family stories, and that my DNA  shows 57% English!  Our family stories also claim much English "Howard" lengends.

Please help!

Rita Mclaughlin

Hello Rita, Maurice, Pat and Christina,

I descend from Frederick Fitzgerald (1803-1881), s/o Margaret Talbot and Edward Fitzgerald.  Frederick is my 3rd great grandfather. I must say researching Irish lines is not easy, especially Church of Ireland!

There isn't much I can add to the above but have found a few (stress few) pieces of information on collateral lines.  Sadly, mtDNA would not help and I have not been tested for it anyway.  I have Ancestry autosomal results and am on GedMatch (A488763) with a Gedcom.   

With extant records so hard to find, I'm hoping DNA may open some doors.

All the best from a distant cousin!

Morgan

Hello Morgan, I too am descended from Frederick Fitzgerald. His daughter Ann married a first cousin Fenton Fitzgerald. Their second son Frederick Horace Fitzgerald is my great grandfather. 

Like you it has been difficult to find records in Ireland. I have done both Ancestry.com and FTDNA.

welcome

Pat