Maher Family in Tipperary

Jamie:

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out!

I searched the subscription site Roots Ireland and found a transcription of Philip's baptismal record in 1862.   The parish register does not show Longhisle so not sure what your source is for the place name. Roots has baptismal records for the following siblings: Ellen 1860 (likely died young) Ellen 1864 John 1866 Martin 1868 Patrick 1870 Andrew 1873 Michael 1875. In 1875, the family was living in Laghile ( Longhisle was incorrect but close) townland in Loughmoe West civil parish. There should be civil birth records available for free at www.irishgenealogy.ie  (Civil Records TAB) for anyone born 1864 or later. John and Mary were married in September 1859. See below.

Let me know if you have questions and keep us posted on your plans for a trip to Ireland in 2019.

Roger McDonnell

Name:Philip MaherDate of Birth:
Date of Baptism:03-May-1862Address:Not RecordedParish/District:LOUGHMOREGender:MaleCountyCo. Tipperary
Denomination:Roman Catholic
Father:John MaherMother:Mary CormackOccupation:Not Recorded
Sponsor 1 /
Informant 1:Patk Carroll Sponsor 2 /
Informant 2:Ann Burke 

Date of Marriage:12-Sep-1859
Parish / District:LOUGHMORE
County:Co. Tipperary
Husband  JohnMaher
Wife MaryCormack

Witness 1
Witness 2Name:JohnBurke
AnneBurke

Roger,

Thank you so much for this information and your speedy reply! You might not believe it– but my father just found a copy of Phillip’s obituary! However this obituary presents some interesting changes. 

1. His name is listed as “Phillip” with 2 L’s

2. It denotes his birth date as March 7, 1859

3. It lists his birthplace as “Temple Moor”

It also mentions a surviving sister, Mrs. J. Moules, and his two brothers Martin and John. 

Would Laghile be considered close enough to Templemore? And what about this birth year discrepancy? I’ve seen 1859 as his birth year also listed on his tombstone and death certificate. Was baptism this late after birth common?

If his parents are indeed John Maher and Mary Cormack, what might be some potential resources to find out more about them? I’ve scoured and searched through Ancestry and haven’t found anything promising about them. 

As for my trip, we are planning to go in April and are planning to stay a few days in this area of Tipperary. Hopefully we can uncover some long lost relatives who are still there! 

Beannachtaí,

Jamie Maher

Jamie:

Don't worry about the spelling for Philip. My guess is that Philip made himself older when he came to America which was a frequent occurrence for emigrants either making themselves older or younger to fit their circumstances. Baptisms occurred very soon after birth usually in the first week.

Laghile is in Loughmoe West civil parish just to the south of Templemore civil parish. I used Google Maps and Laghile townland is only two kilometers from the Garda Training Center in Templemore. Most emigrants would use the largest town/village near their home place when responding to questions.

Regarding John Maher and Mary Cormack if they were baptized in the same parish a record may be available since the Loughmore records go back to 1798 https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0254  The problem is that John Maher is very common and to a lesser degree so is Mary Cormack. You will likely find baptismal records for those names but without knowing their parents names, there is no way to confirm a record located. For example, there are eight John Maher baptismal records in Loughmore parish from 1830-1840, I also checked the 1850 Griffiths Valuation head of household listing for Loughmoe West civil parish and there were Mahers and Cormacks in the parish but none in Laghile.  https://www.failteromhat.com/griffiths/tipperary/loughmoewest.htm

Have you considered DNA testing?

I will alert our HQ about your April trip.

Roger

Roger,

Thank you once again! It’s so exciting getting this information and piecing it together. Although it seems unlikely that I will find any more information about Philip’s parents, I’d imagine it’s fairly likely they were also born in this area. Our trip will definitely include a stop in Templemore! 

Jamie, 

I am also researching Maher families from the same area. I am descended from Martin Maher and Mary Maher [yes they had the same surname] who immigrated to Australia in 1855. I have been building a website for about 20 years now and you can read about them here: http://www.lintywhite.com/maher.html.  I have also had my DNA tested and have had a number of matches to other Maher families in the area but have not yet found an exact link. My Martin Maher was from Templemore when he married Mary Maher in the parish of Loughmore and Castleiny which was probably her parish. He is later described as a farmer of Ballybristy and later again, Brittas.  I have also found that the Maher surname can also be recorded as Meagher. In my families it switches back and forth depending on where and who is recording the event.

Could I make a suggestion to you that your John Maher and Mary Cormack are from Loughisle, which is near Castleotway. I have looked at the various parish registers for the baptisms of their children and that is how the place is spelled LOUGHISLE. You can find it on Google maps. 

I would also like to suggest a possible baptism for John Maher based on the naming pattern of his children. His first son was Phillip [father's father] so look for a baptism of a John Maher with father named Phillip.  There are several to consider.

I would highly recommend DNA testing as it has allowed me to move a bit further backward with my Mahers. The name is so common. It's quite possible that we are related, given our Mahers come from the same areas. 

I hope this helps.

Regards,

Jenny

Hello Jenny,

I’ve actually come across your website before! I commend your dedication and attention to detail. I’ve thought that Loughisle might have been listed on Philip’s baptismal record, but it seems that Loughisle is not in the Loughmore and Castleiney parish, and its also 20 km from Templemore. Is it possible that these parish borders may have changed over time? 

Thank you,

Jamie

Hi Jamie,

Regarding Loughisle; it is listed as their address on the civil registrations of children Ellen 1864, John 1866, Martin 1868, Patrick 1870, Andrew 1873 and Michael 1875. All these civil registrations take place in the District of Moyne, and father John is recorded as being a farmer, address Loughisle [Lough Isle in the case of Andrew's baptism] If you can view the actual baptism entries you will also see that the writing does suggest Loughisle not Laghile. But, not being in Ireland, I don't know if these two placenames are interchangeable. When I look at Google I find Loughisle to be just south of a place named Castleotway. Laghile is further away again, further south east near Kilcommin. 

As to why they chose to baptise the children at Loughmore and Castleiny parish, rather than the closer Templemore or Borrisoleigh parishes, it could be for several reasons. Perhaps Loughmore was the family parish of either John or Mary so they travelled back there for the baptisms. They were married in that parish church so it must have been the parish of one of them at the time [most likely Mary as it was usual to marry in the bride's parish church] Another reason, perhaps the parish priest was a family member? Perhaps Mary travelled to stay with her mother or a sister before the birth of her babies and had them baptised there before she travelled home. Baptisms were usually done quite soon after the birth. In the case of your family, all baptisms are within two days of the birth when you cross check civil births with baptisms.  Not sure if any of that helps you. 

I have made a note of your Maher family and will keep it in my extensive notes on the Mahers in that area. If I should manage to make a family connection I will let you know. Once again I highly recommend DNA testing. If you decide to get it done please let me know so I can look out for any possible matches. Mine was done with Ancestry, but I also uploaded the raw DNA data to Gedmatch. 

Finally, a question for you; do you know what other Maher siblings immigrated to USA? I'd like to add that to my notes if you don't mind.

Regards, Jenny

Jenny, 

I recently got in contact with a north Tipperary geneaologist and she informed me that Loughile was an alternate spelling of Laghile. So they were definitely near Templemore! As for other siblings who came to America, I know that Philip’s brother Martin came to Toledo. He eventually became the fire chief! In Philip’s obituary it mentions a brother John and a sister Mrs. Moules. I do not know about any other siblings coming. 

I have not thus far considered DNA testing, but I will let you know if I do! 

Thank you, Jamie

Loughasile is just accross the road from me . I live in woodville house templemore E41CA40 . Pull that up on google maps and go south on the road . Loughasile is the area on the far side of the road between our house and the railway bridge. there was a family called Mahers living in what was our gate lodge in the 1950's I wounder if there is any connection?

Anne Sayers nee Kelly

There are still burkes living in loughasile in fact there is still an anne burke living there :-) might be a relative of the godmother

I am researching my family home and there is a good chance that some of the Mahers worked as casual labours in our palce. If you want i can take a few pictures of the road side in loughisle just ot give you a feel for it. It is actually right on the boarder betewwn loughmore parish and templemore parish but the people living there now are in the parish of loughmore .  We can be very protective of our parishes here so it would make sense for them to be going to loughmore church. The priest in loughmore at the moment is monsenior Dooley and he is an absolute font of local history knowledge - I would highly recommed you contact him as he will definetly have tons of information for you -- he lives for the history  of the parish and he knows EVERYONES history. I will post the link to the parish website here in a a while and there are phone numbers and e mail on there for you to make contact.

https://cashel-emly.ie/parish/loughmore-castleiney/

dont worry that the priests house is in templemore ...its just that there are three priests in loughmore at the moment and only two houses so one lives in templemore.

let me know how you get on . if you want to see our house we have a site as well www.woodvillehouse.ie  your ancestors would have been visitors to here I'm sure as its just straight across the road

Anne

Hi Anne,

Thank you so much for reaching out! As it happens, my parents and I went to Ireland in April 2019. During our trip, one of the destinations was to visit the area around Templemore. We stayed in the town Killea, and a wonderful Airbnb called The Castle House. I had been in contact with the author Gabrielle O'Meachair, who is a historian of the area. She suggested we visit Monsignor Dooley. We drove to Loughmore and ate at The Cottage while we waited for Monsignor Dooley to arrive back at his house. We visited him for the whole afternoon. You are correct in saying he is a font of historical knowledge! He told us many stories of the area. He went for a drive with us around the area. He was able to point out the Laghile townland.

The next day, we came back to the townland to take a few pictures. While we were there, who drives along but Anne Burke! Ms. Burke also showed us around her property, and talked a bit about the history as well. She was definitely familiar with the name "Maher". She showed us the path over the railroad, and also some remaining ruins of some old houses. We also saw some beautiful horses on the adjacent property, which I believe were yours! She pointed out the Woodville House as well. Being in the townland was such an amazing experience. 

I would LOVE to hear about any more historical information from the area, particularly about any "Maher"s who were living there! 

Jamie Maher

Thank you Anne. My husband and I were due to have a driving holiday around Tipperary and Limerick this coming June but because of the current situation it has been cancelled. We hope to replan our trip when things eventually return to normal. In the meantime I will contact Monsignor Dooley and hopefully he will share some of his knowledge with me. 

Jamie, sounds like you had a wondeful visit. Did you drive around and if so, how did you find the roads? My husband is quite experienced in driving in other countries but I'd be happy to hear any observations you can offer. 

Jenny [Brisbane Australia]

Hi Jenny,

For driving, the roads were all marked on Google Maps, but not all were named roads. Monsignor Dooley pointed the roads out for us. If you search for 'The Cottage' in Loughmore, it will show up. That's a good starting place. The townland of Laghile is around 52°46'53.5"N 7°50'01.0"W

Jamie