Williamson / Magee in Cloncore

Second Cousin:

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out!

It would help our volunteers if you could provide more detail. When did the couple marry? Were they Church of Ireland? Approximate years of birth? I believe the Tartaraghan C of I records are held locally. What happened in 1895?

Roger McDonnell

To date, a marriage record between John Williamson and Hannah Magee (and variations) has not been located.  They do not appear in the RC parish on-line indexed records or in the civil registration index beginning in 1845.    I believe some years are missing for the Loughgall and Tartaraghan RC records, perhaps this is the reason .  

John and Hannah had seven known children --  

Elizabeth born circa 1857 (married 1877 at Tartaraghan C of I) -  four of her children were born in Cloncore, others in Derrinraw, Derrylard and Ballynary, before relocation to Belfast.  

Robert John (born 1861 and baptised 1862 at Tartaraghan C of I) - married in Lisburn and relocated to Belfast.

Hannah (born 1865, Cloncore)

Anne Jane  (1867 Cloncore)

William (1870 Cloncore)  Possibly located in Ballynahinch, Co. Down.?

Rachel (1873 Cloncore)

George (1877 Cloncore - died 1877 Edenderry, Portadown)

John appears in the Griffith Land Valuation Records living in Cloncore in 1864.  He remained at this location until 1895 when his name was removed (ie. Revised Griffith Valuation).   This couple and their daughters are not found in the 1901 or 1911 Ireland Census.  A positive death and/or remarriage for either John and Hannah, or same for their daughters has not been located.

Any suggestions would be most welcoming.

.  

Yes, the marriage records for Tartaraghan/Loughall RC have a gap for almost six years January 1854-September 1859. Also, if they were married RC then there would not be a civil record. Only non-RC marriages from 1845-1863 were civilly registered and RC marriages started in 1864.

In case you were not aware, images of civil records are now available for free at www.irishgenealogy.ie Birth images start in 1864, marriages in 1882 and deaths in 1891. Maybe you can find marriage records for some of the daughters.

Roger

Thank you for the clarification of the RC Tartaraghan/Loughall missing dates.   I have a gut feeling they are one of the missing. It is believed that Hannah Magee is RC and her husband John Williamson was C of I.   On the Tartaraghan C of I baptism of my great grandfather, it gives the name of his mother and then 'alleged' ' (the only entry written this way).  The researcher that I had do this look up, suggested Hannah was RC and not part of the C of I congretation.    

The www.irishgenealogy.ie site is a wonderful resource.  So many hours have been spent looking for this couple and their daughters.  I did find a possible 'if', and now need to cross reference with the 1901 census on the birth location before I rule it out.     

Not sure if this helps or confuses. In process of researching my own Vennards from Tartaraghan, I created a spreadsheet of all I could find. I couldn't help notice the number of times Williamson surname appeared - especially William Williamson. Unclear to me if his relationship is with Tartaraghan parish church or with the Vennard family. Possibly other surnames notice the same pattern & can clarify if parish church connection.

This is an extraction of Williamson:

1851 Mar 6 Thomas Vennert 22 weaver backelor Derrykeeran Armagh to Mary Campbell 21 spinster Derrykeenan Armagh; at Tartaraghan Armagh BY S HALL; fathers: Thomas Vennert weaver Patrick Camp bell fisherman; witnesses: William Williamson & John Finny                                                                        

1857 Jan 9 John Vennard FA farmer bachelor Cloncore Tartaraghan to Mary Jane Harrison FA spinster Cloncore Armagh; by Licence At Tartaraghan Armagh parish church BY G ROBINSON : fathers George Vennard farmer James Harrison farmer; Witnesses: William Martin & William Williamson

1859 Sep 30 Joshua Symington FA labourer bachelor Derrylard Armagh to Elizabeth Anne Venart FA spinster  Cloncore Armagh; at Tartaraghan Armagh by C GRAHAM; fathers: William Symington farmer George Venart labourer; witnesses: James Conlin & William Williamson

1863 Feb 5 James Williamson FA labourer bachelor Ballinary Armagh to Mary Jane Vennart FA spinster Cloncore Armagh; at Tartaraghan Armagh by G ROBINSON; fathers: Jonathan Williamson labourer George Vennart farmer; witnesses: William Hunter & William Williamson                                                               

1866 Sep 25 & 29 (registered) Civil Birth Venart  Thomas Tartaraghan CP Ballinarry Co. Armagh parents: Edward Venart weaver Martha Williamson; note: Edward Venart Father Ballinarry

1866 Oct 18 Francis Vennard FA labourer bachelor Cloncore Tartaraghan to Ellen Medcalf FA spinster Cloncore Armagh: at Tartaraghan Armagh by  ROBINSON; fathers: George Vennard farmer Samuel Medcalf weaver; witnesses: John Cole & William Williamson

1868 Sep 18 James Fox FA mason bachelor Derryaugh Armagh to Ruth Vennart FA spinster Tartelogue; at Tartaraghan Armagh by G ROBINSON; fathers: William Fox labourer William Vennart farmer; witnesses: William Jetta & William Williamson                                                                                                         

1870 Dec 30 John Vennart FA labourer bachelor Ballinary Armagh to Theresa Vennart FA spinster Cloncore Armagh; at Tartaraghan Armagh by G ROBINSON; fathers: Joseph Vennart weaver George Vennart farmer; witnesses: William Williamson & William Cole                                          

1874 Nov 7 William John Venard FA labourer bachelor Ballynary Armagh to Matilda Gibson 19 spinster Clonmacash Armagh; COI Tartaraghan Armagh by G ROBINSON; fathers: Edward Venard weaver James Gibson weaver; witnesses: William Williamson & John Gibson

1878 Sep 26 Edward Venart FA labourer bachelor Ballynary Armagh to Rachel McCullagh minor spinster Cloncore Armagh; COI Tartaraghan Armagh BY ME G ROBINSON; fathers: Edward Venart weaver James McCullagh farmer; witnesses: James Trotter & William Williamson

Thank you so much for taking the time and trouble to post to my Williamson query.

William Williamson is a mystery.   He too appears as witness on the marriage of my great grandfather's sister.   

Finding records for him, aside from witnessing most marriages, has been unsuccessful.   He doesn't appear to have any children of his own that married at the Tartaraghan Church of Ireland.  

I believe he may have been the church Sexton.  

I thought I'd have quick peak to see if your John & Hannah might have gone to Glasgow. My 2x great grandfather Thomas Wright Vennard was married in Tartaraghan in 1846 to Mary Ann Taggart & then not much is known of them until late 1870s when shows up in Glasgow as a missionary for United Presbyterian church. On 1881 census he is in Northmavine, Shetlands as missionary, then back in Glasgow a couple years later living at Crossmyloof, at well known Crossmyloof Bakery (Neale Thomson). I was curious if I could locate Williamson's as neighbours or the like without success. So I then ran a search at ScotlandsPeople to see if a John and or Hannah Williamson showed up on the 1851 census. I was very surprised to find many, many Williamsons living at Northmavine on 1851 census - 6 William Williamsons alone. Very remote place. Then to find attached 1851 census for John (of Edinburgh), Hannah (of Shetlands), and 5 yr old William.

One of my biggest questions is when & where did TW Vennard practice to be a missionary & why Northmavine? Who was his influence? Now that I see this 1851 census, it opens up a bunch of questions for me on the Williamson impact on TW Vennard. Hmmmm. Good luck in your search.

I've mistitled the attached record. It should read as 1851 census.

I've found another reference & this is directly connected to my tree. Martha Williamson married Edward Vennard (brother to previously mentioned Thomas Wright Vennard missionary). I see Martha's father is John Williamson. Hmmm

From: http://ifhf.rootsireland.ie/view_detail.php?recordid=801875&type=mcv&re…

Civil Marriage Record

Date of Marriage: 23-Jan-1851

Parish / District: MILLTOWN CI

County: ARMAGH

Husband Edward Vernnard weaver FA bachelor

Residence Derinraw

Wife Martha Williamson FA spinster

Residence Ballynary

Denomination:

Husband's Father Name: Thomas Vernnard weaver

Wife's Father John Williamson cottier

Witnesses: John Williamson, John Harvey

Notes:

MARRIED IN THE CHURCH OF MILLTOWN ACCORDING TO THE RITES AND CEREMONIES OF THE UNITED CHURCH OF ENGLAND AND IRELAND BY LICENCE BY ME C CROSSLE/ [FA=FULL AGE]