Holland family

K. Menagh:

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out!

I found the 1891 civil marriage record for William and Agnes. See link below. You will have to sign-in to see the record. The record implies that his father William was still alive in 1891.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_re…

I tried to find the death records for William and Margaret with no success.(I did not look at all the William and Margaret records). Death record images are available starting 1891. You may want to see if you can find the records at www.irishgenealogy.ie 

Roger McDonnell

Roger,

Thank you for your assistance and reply.  I have made very good use of the irishgenealogy.ie website.  That is where I found much of my information.  I also used the the national archive and PRONI websites.  The family just seemed to disappear.

Do you have any other suggestions.

KMenagh

Where a complete family appears to disappear, it's often because they left Ireland. I'd be inclined to search the Scottish and English censuses in case they moved there. (They were the most likely destinations for those who did not move overseas). 

Hi Kmenagh, I think this is my family... !

John Holland married Mary Alice Speakman in UK - Lancashire (Preston), and the next generations stayed in Lancashire or moved to Canada, USA, France (I'm a descendant of Charles William Holland, John's son)... As I can't access Irish records (I'm located in France), I can't climb the tree, but I'm 99% sure that it's well my family due to the fact that John's father named William is well mentionned as a coachman on the wedding certificate of John...

Let me know if we can get in touch to confirm all of this :)

Abyss

Abyss,

Thank you for the response.  It is very tantalizing.  However, my concern is my John Holland, son of William Holland, born in Ireland has a birth date of ~1867 and your John Holland, son of William Holland, born in Ireland seems to have a birth date of ~1861.  I have found that birth dates can be very unreliable.  I am willing to explore the possiblity of a connection with you and see if it can be clarified.  Have you or an elder relative done DNA testing?  Do you have any other information that may be useful such as death records or obituaries.  I look forward to hearing from you.

KMenagh

Hello Kmenagh, You are right about the 1860/1861 birth date but we can't get earlier than 1864 on the birth registries. And the first children you have found is 1866 but the wedding is 1862. As the father William is a coachman it's obviously same family as none of the other Holland I have found have this profession (and on my side they are horse trainer and taxi men for generations... they are from Belfast for sure - Anglican religion). So if they are not the same John, one other option is that my John is the eldest of the children and the brother of your John which can make sense. My concern is that William wedding is in 1862 so Margaret Mahon may be not the mother of my John. I had found a Margaret as potential mother many years ago but can't find a birth act so also confusing (maybe Lee for last name but can't confirm). I have also found a Joseph Holland born in Belfast area around 1838 and I'm wondering if it's the brother of William (wedding 1857 with Mary Ann Anderson but can't read the professions) ? No DNA testing that I know if you are talking about the alzheimer test, my grand ma had alzheimer but not sure today is something we can rely on. So still looking for more clues to confirm :) are you in Ireland or UK ? My tree is here under if you want to have a look, I'm exploring all holland to see if we can find a connection somewhere but in Northern Ireland it's difficult. We are also linked with Park and Bell families in UK who seems coming from Ireland if it can be a pist (I beleive that people moving in UK stayed in communities). I'm very grateful you replied and happy to share documents or thoughts !
Nice dat to you.

https://www.ancestry.fr/family-tree/pt/RSVP.aspx?dat=MTE5MzQ3NjA1OzswNT…

Hi Kmenagh

My mum found the wedding certificate of Sarah with John Henry Bannister - doc attached. And we have found a birth declaration in 1906 for a Sarah Bannister by a John William Holland and Annie Elizabeth Kieltie. Agnes Sinclair's mother is also a Kieltie... Wondering is there's any link... ? Also if it's Sarah born in 1876 she had 12 yo in 1888 or second option it's another Sarah born before 1866... but again it's obviously same family for me with this William as father with profession Coach Man.

Abyss

I found Margaret Holland in the 1901 census.  Daughter Edith Mabel born in 1877 married William Lawrence in 1908 and moved to Scotland with him.  She seems to have had an older sister Sarah who died at 3 days old on 10th June 1875 and another Sarah born on 17th May 1876.

On her Scottish death certificate, Edith Mabel is called "formerly Sarah" so I wonder if she took her dead sisters' name.  She had another older sister Mary Ellen who was known as Elsie.