Canadian with Irish roots

Debra!
Irish records, as you know, get scarce, especially around early 1800's.  Have you tried searching the Church of Ireland  Tithes Applotment (1823-37)?    This is one of the census substitutes that might provide a small bit of help for that time period.   All tenants of land were required to pay this tithe whether they were CofI or RC.  If they were not tenants on a farm I don't believe they would be listed.   

For example I found the following link for a "Ruddy Micke Joyce" in Glencullen Kirkwood townland in Kilcommon parish paying a Tithe in 1834.  He could possibly be Patrick's father or another relation.  Although not a lot of info. is provided with this entry, at least this ID provides you with a townland that might aid in you in your process of elimination search of any possible remaining parish records. 

http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/reels/tab//004587457/00…

When I looked for Monaghans in the Tithes, this is what I found:  

http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?…

You will note that Thomas, Michael, Owen and John were listed as paying Tithes in 1834.  Another "fun" thing about researching the Irish is that we need to remember sometimes that our Irish families used nicknames or middle name instead of given birth name to distinquish him/her from another of the same name in extended family.  So Owen (Eion), for example, might be a substitute for one of the names you are searching.

After you examine these records, you might want to see which Joyces & Monaghans, if any, remained behind or were still alive after the "An Gorta Mor" in Kilcommon by looking at Griffiths Valuation (starts around 1854) which is Free at various websites.  If you find any try tracing them on the 1901 and 1911 Irish Census to see if you possibly have current day unknown relations remaining in Bellmullet, Kilcommon area.   Perhaps one of them will see your post here just as a newly-discovered Mylott cousin did for me.  Having visited Ireland (including Bellmullet area) again last September doing research, I have found over and over, there are some very beautiful giving people who will help to go with the beautiful scenery. 

Hope this helps!  Good Luck!

Slan!

Tom Malone

Hello Tom, 

Thank you for your prompt reply. I have spent much time looking at the Titlhes Applotment, Griffiths Valuation and the 1901 census, and printed out all results that were any possibility I could see for being ancestors of mine. There are many John, James, and Patrick Joyces, along with Anthonys and Francis  I especially like the census, which includes occupations and literacy details.  So far I think that Atticonaun for Monaghans, Binghamstown or Emilybeg for Joyces and Aghaglasheen, Belmullet or Glencastle for the Barretts.

Because there are usually a fair number of possible name matches, I have not yet been able to firmly identify exactly where, in what township my people were located.  I printed out the griffiths maps and added possible names onto the proper number site, but none of it was definitive enough for me to say, "Yes, those are the ones!"  My sense is that my ancestors were hard working people who did not stand out especially, and kept close to their family.  I was hoping when I posted on Ireland reaching out, some familiar name or combination of names would stand out for someone.

I have been well supplied with material such as parish birth records for Barretts and Monaghans starting in 1860 and other suggestions from an ancestry email friend in Belmullet, which is how I learned about this site.  I keep thinking that I have more than enough material if I only knew how to systematically put it together.  Its the verification of several unique details that seems to be the most convincing.  Time, names and places and relationships all sync-ing together.

How do professional researchers know they have accuracy when they are working with genealogy unknowns?

Debra

Debra!

You raise a good question.  I do not know how they can guarantee that either.  

I am not a "professional" genealogist, but a retired Masachusetts principal and history teacher. I have a strong interest in history and locating members of my Irish paternal and maternal family tree past and present.  Considering I started in 2005 with very little family info. I feel I have been somewhat successful since then.  I have found as I have been doing my Irish Family research when I have lacked certainty searching documents, in some instances I have had to resort to triangulating things geographically using google maps, Griffiths valuation, family naming traditions to augment the sketchy docs and go with that until proven wrong when I network with others.   I have found networking on Ancestry.com, keeping non-living members public on my tree, posting on message boards, DNA testing, posting on websites like here and especially the Mayo Genealogy Group Facebook page I can get a lot more done with other people's help. The interaction I have had on Mayo FB with locals has been extremely helpful.   Networking like this is like planting seeds in a field.  The seeds don't always bear fruit, but other times they do.  If you keep all of your seeds private they will never bear any fruit.

It was only with the above networking help that I figured out the story I posted here on XO earlier.  Some of your relatives and mine might have been neighbors.  Most of my Malone family members eventually moved from Glenhest where I first found them to Ballina, Ballinrobe or Kilcommon area.  They must have come because my 2nd great grandfather, John, had a brother, Rev. Patrick Malone who was an activist Killala Diocese parish priest during and after "An Gorta Mor" who worked in the Glencastle and Bellmullet churches. He was also a tenant on a few pieces of land listed in Griffiths.  John moved to Glengad. John's son John married a Theresa McKenzie and lived for a time in Binghamstown and Emilybeg respectively.   Eventually in 1873 Rev. Malone died and left my 2nd ggf John 800 pounds worth of effects.  As a result the Malone's finally had enough money to book passage and emigrate to US and arrive around 1875.    

Good luck with your research!

Slan!
Tom 

Tom,

Thanks again for your thorough advice and suggestions on finding ancestry records.  I am pleased with the progress I have made so far, ancestry.com has been consistently helpful and as a retired school librarian, I had some research skills and have been able to expand with their additions.  Online sites like this one seem to be increasing all the time.

My genealogy email contacts include people in New Jersey, Belmullet, Australia, Texas, Wisconsin and Georgia, and every once in a while a surprise comes through.

The Irish diaspora, I would say, was very rich and successful in blending with the rest of the world.

Debra

Tom,

Thanks again for your thorough advice and suggestions on finding ancestry records.  I am pleased with the progress I have made so far, ancestry.com has been consistently helpful and as a retired school librarian, I had some research skills and have been able to expand with their additions.  Online sites like this one seem to be increasing all the time.

My genealogy email contacts include people in New Jersey, Belmullet, Australia, Texas, Wisconsin and Georgia, and every once in a while a surprise comes through.

The Irish diaspora, I would say, was very rich and successful in blending with the rest of the world.

Debra

Debra!
As you know Facebook has many issues and detractors.  The fiesty & ageless American actress Bette White has joked, "What a big waste of time!!!".  But I have found otherwise, especially when I joined the Mayo Genealogy Facebook Group. The group members there have been more than willing to make suggestions and provide hints that have moved me along in my journey.    Since many members are local Irish who know genealogy, neighbors, and the actual lay of the land, they have often contributed links, contacts, and suggestions that I do not think I would have found on my own.  Sometimes I have received responses, like here, within an hour of posting.  Some are also XO volunteers. They have also compiled a list of surnames and the members who are doing the research to make networking even easier.  There are other Irish & County Facebook pages one can join, but I have found this community to be a model for being the most forthcoming, friendly, and generous.   

If you and others have not joined Facebook or this group, I would highly recommend you consider it.  If you live in Mayo or are visiting, they hold their monthly meetings the 2nd Saturday of the month at the National Museum for Irish Culture & History in Turlough, Co. Mayo. 

Tom

Tom,

I had a look at the Mayo Genealogy Facebook  Group, and it looks like the best sort of use of facebook.  I have up to now resisted any participation in Facebook, preferring face-to-face interaction, and I have enough trouble keeping up with email communication, as I am president of our local Hospice society, secretary of the local community funding foundation, part of a choir, and a marimba group, facilitator of a Lifewriters group, etc.  So I would see this group as an obligation to keep up with, and when spring comes I will be out in the garden, too.

But it looks like a perfect fit for genealogy interaction.  I am going to urge my cousin Drue (she is the one on the right in my profile picture)  to look at this group, I think she uses Facebook.

Thanks again,

Debra